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Post by vandergraafk on Nov 18, 2006 14:31:57 GMT -5
A fantastic episode from start to finish. Not only is this episode one of the finest ever made, it also kicks off a fantastic four-run episode arc that is one of the most compelling in Charmed. Phoebe almost dies. Piper loses her powers. Leo almost succombs to a darklighter's arrow. Paige loses her powers, but gains confidence as a witch. And, Cole becomes the Source.
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Post by vandergraafk on Feb 20, 2007 19:03:51 GMT -5
I am less and less able to explain why the Source was vanquished in a nuclear blast by the Hollow (Cole) throwing fireballs at the Source while the Charmed Ones recite their spell. If the Hollow consumes all powers - used and latent - then why should the Source, stripped of his powers by the Hollow, require any special vanquish at all. He was just another defenseless demon!
Now, let me turn to the Hollow. The Hollow is a concept that was only weakly developed in Charmed. We are told that it consumes all magic. Yet, apparently a magical entity, perhaps one powerful enough to attempt the feat, can extract powers from the Hollow, albeit at the price of gradual insanity. In Charmed and Dangerous we witness the Hollow absorbed Piper's powers and remove Paige's power to move objects by orbing. Whether the Hollow absorbs her power to orb is left unexplored. Since Paige cannot yet orb between rooms or serve as a cosmic taxi, there is no direct test of the hypothesis that the Hollow absorbs all magical powers. In Forever Charmed, we have an answer, though the answer serves only to muddle the waters more.
Future Wyatt has come back in time because he loses his powers. Casting a spell with brother Chris, Wyatt determines that the powers were lost during the events leading up to the Hollow driven portion of the Ultimate Battle Mark I. When Piper, Paige, Phoebe and Billie correct the events of UBMI before the Hollow is unleashed, future Wyatt's powers are restored. As proof, we watch Wyatt orb from one place to another. Apparently, the Hollow had taken not only his protection shield, but also his orbing ability, a result that Dumain had assured us would happen.
How, then, are we to square this with the events in Charmed and Dangerous? When Cole as the Hollow absorbs the Source's fireball, he MUST acquire all of the Source's powers. At this important juncture, the Source would be as powerless as Piper or Paige. Why, then, does his vanquish require a relentless barage of fireballs and a power of three spell and result in a nuclear blast? He should have been vanquished by a simple potion.
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Post by vandergraafk on Mar 13, 2007 22:47:17 GMT -5
I can't say how many times I've watched this episode. It's one of all time favorites. After about the fiftieth viewing, I noticed (finally) that the demonic Guardian of the Hollow uses Piper's power to attack her (when he blasts the sewing machine to pieces), proof that he absorbed her power. I am also most impressed with the Source's use of Piper's power in a way that Piper will not yet develop for several seasons.
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Post by Reality Bites on Sept 16, 2007 22:45:17 GMT -5
Why, then, does his vanquish require a relentless barage of fireballs and a power of three spell and result in a nuclear blast? He should have been vanquished by a simple potion. Why not? The Source's active powers aren't what make him the Source of All Evil. It was his coronation, after all, that granted him the magical status of being the Source of All Evil. Piper and Paige, though powerless, remain Charmed and very capable of casting individual spells (Paige casting the vanishing spell on Caroline) and all three sisters casting spells using the Power of Three (one to inadvertently summon the Source via calling their powers, and a second to vanquish the Source himself). If Paige and Piper merely lost their active powers to the Hollow, but retain all other magical aspects that goes with being a witch, a Charmed One, then it goes to stand the Source retained any other beneficial traits that belongs to the current reigning leader of the Underworld that weren't a stigma of his active powers. Remember, though Cole possessed the powers of the Source after the events of Charmed and Dangerous, he still needed a coronation to actually become the ruler of the Underworld. Perhaps the Source's mere status as the Source of All Evil allowed him to withstand a barrage of fireballs from Cole, just as Piper and Paige's status as Charmed Ones allowed them to successfully cast a Power of Three spell though stripped of their active powers. If this is the case, Cole throwing fireballs at the Source would not be sufficient enough to vanquish the Source, and the Charmed Ones' vanquishing spell was still, indeed, needed. Calling the Source a defenseless demon because he lost his "fire power" is as biased as stating Phoebe is not as potent a witch as her sisters because she lacks the active powers they possess.
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Post by vandergraafk on Sept 27, 2007 18:47:31 GMT -5
This is a most impressive suggestion, one that I hadn't even considered. Well, let's see. We know that the coronation ceremony is important since it does make that demon the ruler of the underworld, or - as the title suggests - the Source of All Evil. By this then, we must understand that the Source is neither the most powerful of all demons nor evil incarnate (we are told that the TRIAD are - see Kill Billie, Volume 2). Maybe the Source of All Evil is simply is title - no more or no less powerful than someone being the President of the United States or the United Nations General Secretary. Still, perhaps Reality Bites is onto something when it is strongly suggested that the coronation actually gives the officer holder much more. Perhaps it is a powerful aura that no potion can vanquish and maybe repeated fireballs are required in order to blast this.
Consider the implications. The Charmed Ones never were then able to vanquish the Source potion or otherwise. They were able to vanquish Cole only by invoking the entire Warren line of witches and by brewing a very powerful potion. When Cole becomes Invincible, it is in large measure because he has acquired so many demonic powers. Yet, both he and Barbas can be stripped of this power perhaps because there is no aura - like the Source of All Evil's - to protect either of them. But then, Cole as Mr. Invincible ought to have been vanquishable by a combination of potions and the entire Warren line of witches. This was never tried in Sam I Am because Phoebe refused to throw the potion and Cole could not invoke the Warren line of witches power in his suicide by witch efforts. Fascinating!
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