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Post by vandergraafk on Nov 17, 2006 11:57:17 GMT -5
This charming episode has lots to offer. Phoebe has a new hairdo. All three girls get decked out in skimpy leather outfits. Leo becomes a warrior. Darryl has his soul swiped by Paige and Phoebe, a lethal power of two. Chris is back, but what an evil little snit he seems to be and a player, too! Piper has become an eternally optimistic Stepford wife, albeit one without a husband since Leo has gone missing.
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Post by vandergraafk on Nov 17, 2006 11:58:38 GMT -5
Controversy is never far away in Charmedverse. Consider ljones take on the borrowing of Darryl's soul in Valhalla of the Dolls Part 1:
And I've also noticed that Phoebe and Paige's remorse for certain actions - raping Darryl's soul and setting up Rick's murder - always seemed to come across as those two paying lip service to their consciences.
vandergraafk glibly replied:
A bit melodramatic, aren't we? The sisters did not "rape" Darryl's soul. Lord knows, I don't want to ask you for your definition of rape. Second, the sisters did not set up Rick's murder. But, then some do like the extreme sounds of extreme statements that bear no basis in fact.
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Post by vandergraafk on Nov 17, 2006 12:00:06 GMT -5
Triad provided the following illuminating contribution:
A bit melodramatic, aren't we? The sisters did not "rape" Darryl's soul. Lord knows, I don't want to ask you for your definition of rape. Second, the sisters did not set up Rick's murder. But, then some do like the extreme sounds of extreme statements that bear no basis in fact.
Definition of Rape:
–noun 1. the unlawful compelling of a woman through physical force or duress to have sexual intercourse. 2. any act of sexual intercourse that is forced upon a person. 3. statutory rape. 4. an act of plunder, violent seizure, or abuse; despoliation; violation: the rape of the countryside. 5. Archaic. the act of seizing and carrying off by force. –verb (used with object) 6. to force to have sexual intercourse. 7. to plunder (a place); despoil. 8. to seize, take, or carry off by force. –verb (used without object) 9. to commit rape.
rape1 (rp) Pronunciation Key n. The crime of forcing another person to submit to sex acts, especially sexual intercourse. The act of seizing and carrying off by force; abduction. Abusive or improper treatment; violation: a rape of justice.
Rape can be used in the terms ljones has stated... They took Darryl's Soul without his consent to me. So, the possesion of his soul was by force, and he was abused by the sisters in this way.
And as proof; Phoebe: Darryl, we need your help.
Darryl: Does this have anything to do with you asking Sheila to watch Wyatt? She just called.
Phoebe: Yes, actually. But we don't have a lot of time. It's about Leo.
Darryl: You found him?
Paige: Actually, yeah, we did.
Phoebe: And we need your help to save him.
Darryl: Sure, you know that, just ask, anything.
Phoebe: Great! We just need to borrow your soul for a couple of hours.
Paige: Yeah, we'll get it right back.
Phoebe: It's perfectly safe, really. You're body will just slip into a coma and as long as we get your soul back in time...
Paige: Which we will.
Phoebe: You'll be fine. Just a little headache, that's all. What do you say?
(Silence.)
Darryl: You're serious, aren't you?
Phoebe: Please, Darryl, it's the only way we can save Leo.
Darryl: No! I ain't doing it.
Phoebe: Darryl, please.
Darryl: No, absolutely not! Listen, I love Leo like a brother but you know, there's a limit to what you ask me to do.
(He turns and walks off mumbling to himself. Paige throws a potion at him and his body drops to the ground, leaving just his soul walking along.)
Paige: Uh, Darryl?
Darryl: What?
(He turns around. Paige points to his body on the ground.)
Darryl: Oh. That's just great.
(Phoebe opens a small bottle and his soul gets sucked into it. She puts on the lid.)
The references are from Dictionary.com and Charmed Scripts. While Paige and Phoebe's desicion,about Rick, is really sketchy to me, i don't really want to get too deep into the situation anymore.
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Post by vandergraafk on Nov 17, 2006 12:01:00 GMT -5
Now, armed and dangerous, vandergraafk launched into the analysis:
Thanks for the definitions. Of course, it would be nice to know how ljones used the word. In the event, I still find it quite "over the top". To use "rape" to describe what happened to Darryl's soul is stretching the rubber band past the breaking point. Watch out for the recoil!
Second, the definitions of rape that you provide contain two related but distinctly different literal meanings and a clear figurative meaning. The first literal meaning involves sexual compulsion without consent. Clearly, Darryl was not "raped" in this sense. The second literal meaning involves the despoiling of an object (not a sentient being), such as the countryside, farmland, natural resources. Clearly, again, Darryl was not "raped" in this sense. Nor was he "raped" in the expanded, more figurative, sense of this definition such as the phrase commonly used in academe, i.e., to "rape" a book. This figurative use of the second definition means to tear apart (deconstruct) a book's concrete elements (isn't this what we do in Charmed Cafe, and what I do in my forum Charmedverse?), then reconstruct it in perhaps a more meaningful or insightful way. Clearly, Darryl was not "raped" in this sense.
What's left is the final, poorly understood, literal meaning in the definition that you provided. Let's start with where I think you began (since it is highlighted): The act of seizing and carrying off by force; abduction. Clearly, Darryl's soul was seized and carried by without the consent of Darryl.
However, to state that this constitutes rape is misunderstanding of what this definition actually says. By making this leap, you conflate to concepts that are not the same juridically. Kidnapping is also the act of seizing (a person) and carrying off (that self-same person) without consent (i.e., by force). So, are you telling me that kidnapping and raping are now the same! Hardly!
The context that you slip over is that the act of seizing and carrying off by force must be connect with sexual compulsion. If I say the troops raped and pillaged the village, I understand that they may have captured young women (or women of any age for that matter), perhaps taken them to a remote location (not a necessary condition) and engaged in sexual acts without the consent of the victim. Pillage is a synonym for the second literal meaning of rape (plundering the village perhaps of its stores of wheat, etc.).
Nowhere in Valhalla of the Dolls do I see that Darryl's soul, once taken and removed to another location (Valhalla), was abused for sexual purposes. Thus, there was no "raping" of Darryl's soul. It sounds extreme. It is extreme. And, unfortunately, is just another example of the diatribe used by Charmed detractors - or fans pissed off by the show's evolution - to attack the show.
Yes, there is a problem with what the sisters' did. Notice that it's Paige and Phoebe (again or actually before since this episode predates Hyde School Reunion). But, the problem does not arise because Darryl's soul was raped.
P.S. May I add a personal and final comment with respect to the definition of rape. When my house was burgled years ago, I experienced what I called rape. I felt that my privacy had been violated. It took many months for me to feel safe in my home. Yet, even though the sanctity of my home had been violated, it really wasn't rape. I was not sexually abused. I wasn't even home at the time. Yet, use of the word helped me gain insight into one aspect of rape, especially if it occurs in the home. Women (or men) who are raped at home have a double difficulty. Beyond the sheer devastation of the act itself, there must also be the sense that home, the place where the crime occurred, has also been violated. The sense of trust must surely be broken. I suspect that it would take far longer for that to heal that it did for me to regain confidence in the security of my own home.
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Post by vandergraafk on Nov 27, 2007 20:13:53 GMT -5
As noted above, this episode has generated a lot of controversy, not least of which is the "borrowing" - pretty please - of Darryl's soul for a few hours. Vandergraafk noted one of the other big problems in Valhalley of the Dolls, an episode that set Charmed down a strange, and at times, problematic path. In the Charmed Cafe, vandergraafk wrote:
"During the Charmed marathon on Thanksgiving Day, I watched with awe and amazement at the two-parter episode Valhalley of the Dolls. If there were ever a show that messed with Charmed, then this show is it. First, let's ignore the fact that Piper was practically a Stepford wife throughout the entire episode. Okay, maybe a zombie is more like it. Second, let's ignore the fact that the dialogue is not particularly funny or well-written. Third, let's not ignore the fact that in this episode the Charmed Ones are instructed to vanquish a demon on command by Chris. As the episode opens, Chris is trying to gather up the Charmed Ones, each going her separate way, except Piper who is too annoyingly chipper to going any way except crazy, in order to vanquish a demon who rarely visits the temporal plane of existence that the Charmed Ones occupy. Ha ha, the Trok has two heads and Piper blasts one of them off before the Charmed Ones vanquish this demon with a power of three spell.
Why, though, do the Charmed Ones vanquish this demon? Frankly, we are never given a reason. The fact that this demon rarely visits the Charmed Ones' plane of existence should mean that it poses very little threat to any innocents in San Francisco or beyond. There is no reason that this demon should have been vanquished by the Charmed Ones. Unfortunately, this does, however, open the floodgates to all of the demon vanquishing that Chris will have the sisters accomplish in this season, the season where I believe Charmed to have taken two steps backward for the one step forward they took (developing a new character: Chris)"
Whitelightertony sought to blunt the thrust of this criticism by suggesting other venues of explanations. In the Charmed Cafe, he noted:
"I think the main reason was because Chris wanted to cover all his bases. But that does lead to some interesting questions?
Is the Trok Demon still alive in Chris's future. Has Chris never had any experience with the Trok Demon, and that's why he suspects it may be responsible for turning Wyatt?
And I'd be careful about ruling out the legitimacy behind Chris's action just because the Trok Demon presides on another plane of existence. Demons can always find excuses to cross over from other realms (i.e. Abraxas), if they really want to. Look at how long the Avatars lurked and waited. Perhaps there was something written about the Trok Demon in the Book of Shadows that led Chris to suspect it might pose a threat to Wyatt, based on the Trok Demon's specific desires or motives?"
Vandergraafk welcomed these suggestions, but pointed out that the writers do not mine any of this territory. They ignore the whole problem their depiction of Chris and the sisters causes with respect to Charmedverse:
"Your suggestions point to possible ways out of the dilemma. However, without the proper foundation established - why is the Trok demon a threat, etc. - this comes across as just another demon bash, the first in a long list that Chris is going to foist on the Charmed Ones during Season 6. For the writing collective to glibly gloss over the needed foundation and invariably alter the modus operandi of the Charmed Ones Season 6 suggests to me a serious conceptual problem in the formulation and execution of the Season 6 story arc."
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